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View Full Version : Why this game is dying and a way to save it.



Eden-
14th January 2010, 05:08 AM
I've been back for a week, after not having played this game in over 5 years. And let me tell you this game has seen better days. And it hasn't taken me very long to see what's damaged this game so. I see a lot of people complaining about changes the admins have made as being the cause to this game's decline, and I feel that is absolute rubbish. Do you realize the admins are here to make this game enjoyable for everyone, they have already made their money, if they didn't care about the game and its players they could pull the plug whenever they want and shut the game down for good. The game is not in jeopardy because of them. When I played this game there were over 200,000 accounts, now there is less than 7,000. And the real people to blame behind this decline are the players themselves. This is a game of war, yes. And in recent histories it has developed into something so much more.

This game allows people to play with others all over the world and develop friendships and bonds with people they would otherwise never know or have the company of, probably in their lifetimes. Politics and alliances developed. Scaled scenarios of conflict and disputes, triumphs and hope. Great leaders and players emerged and were forged. The only thing that has remained an unchanged plague in this game, is the absolute havoc and anarchy waged by its wars. Players unforgivingly destroy others without conscious thought of its irrepairable long-term reprecussions.

A new player is recruited into an alliance, he just started playing a week ago. Little he was aware of by joining this alliance, unknowingly being cast into the workforce of a clan waging war. He was recruited to click and grow and provide his commander with an army. He didn't know any better, and each day goes by where his items and soldiers are utterly destroyed by supporting a cause he never even had the chance to realize he was a part of. Another day passes and he deletes his account and parts with the game. This is one person, one example.. Times 1,000.. Perhaps Times 10,000 or even 100,000 over the ages. This game has lost it's potential for future generations unforgivingly, giving most new players no chance to have fun or develop.. anything at all.. A friendship, an army, a rank.. No chance whatsoever to make any sort of achievement or develop any care at all for this game. Instead we are left with perhaps 1,500 or less dedicated players.. How long till that number is zero I ask.

You want to ask me what I think will help this game? The wars need more civility. There needs to be some sort of 'geneva's convention' type of ground rules set by knowledgeable and sensible leaders in warring guilds. Just because LaCN had 350 members doesn't mean every single one of them deserves to be destroyed on a regular basis. When the U.S. entered World War II, they didn't put the american engineers and workers who built their tanks and aircraft and ships on the front lines of battle, they weren't soldiers. So why should it be any different for a new young player who clicks and logs in once a day to tinker around, why should they be destroyed and completely turned off from this game? So when you look for ways to blame why this game has taken such a downfall, you only have to look within yourselves and your own actions over the past ages and then you will know why.

There are players in this game with a lot of power and say. They have the means to make this happen, and therefore they have the responsibility to make this happen. There is no guarantee this could work, and it may already be too late. But if we don't try, things will continue the way they have and this game will still be doomed. So step it up, and do what's right for the integrity of this game, if you care, if you really care.

-Eden

LordCounter
14th January 2010, 07:13 AM
this isnt kings of treehuggers. if you want to have intimate relationships on the internet go e-dating or w/e

and what new players are you talking about anyway, its pretty hard destroying an account that hasnt got any weps cause he just started.

and among those 200k players there were thousands and thousand of fakes and a shit load of ppl that were simply playing koc cause it was the most popular game around. after some years those players leave cause its not that interesting anymore whether they add a 3d function to koc or make nice lil colours w/e .and the fakes are all mostly gone too. i.e 7k players who still like it. and they now get a crappy age cause the admins do shit. i dont give a flying shit the admins made their money already cause we gave it to them and we'd like to see some maintenance of the game we've been playing for so many years. dont come up with bs stories that its the players' fault cause they dont wanna be lil buddies with each other

Santa87
14th January 2010, 07:46 AM
I agree 100% with Eden-....
Back in age 2, 3, 4, and I think also age 5, there were a general agreement between all alliances that Chaining alliances, were considered illegal, and if a guy was chaining in a war, he rarely would be allowed to be in the alliance. This ensured that the people who werent active in the war(due to low strength, or due to being a new player) wouldnt be punished for being in the alliance. Sometime during age 5/6 that changed, with the sab clans giving crab about that unspoken agreement.

MarriedToTheMob
14th January 2010, 08:32 AM
The wars need more civility.



I agree with this point, but it is not only the wars which lack civility. It is also the general behavior of many koc players lacking civility. This is displayed both on gua through unnecessary flaming and insensitivity toward new players, and in game through messaging and bullying.

I also wish you would have split that into paragraphs cause it's really hard to read :P

jog1
14th January 2010, 11:17 AM
I agree 100% with Eden-....
Back in age 2, 3, 4, and I think also age 5, there were a general agreement between all alliances that Chaining alliances, were considered illegal, and if a guy was chaining in a war, he rarely would be allowed to be in the alliance. This ensured that the people who werent active in the war(due to low strength, or due to being a new player) wouldnt be punished for being in the alliance. Sometime during age 5/6 that changed, with the sab clans giving crab about that unspoken agreement.

It wasn't considered illegal to chain in a war. I was considered illegal to chain an alliance because of 1 person. it's still pretty much the same.

loofa4
14th January 2010, 04:52 PM
this isnt kings of treehuggers. if you want to have intimate relationships on the internet go e-dating or w/e

and what new players are you talking about anyway, its pretty hard destroying an account that hasnt got any weps cause he just started.

You're looking for these new players? Hi. I started at the very end of age 12, and almost quit halfway through this beta due to exactly the reasons eden gave. I was being sabbed hardcore for simply being in an alliance that someone got mad at. The only reason I stayed is that my commander is a great guy and covered all my losses for me.

You are right in saying that this isn't the place for intimate relationships, but it is a place where you are supposed to have fun. Getting your ass handed to you for no reason is NOT fun, and say what you want, but the more new players don't have fun, the more they will quit.

SleepingDragon
14th January 2010, 05:07 PM
Only reason KoC and KoC on GUA is still active is because people want to see the cripple fight war going on. It basically comes down to who is more self-loathing and outlasts their rival's frustrations and headaches. If people are less civil than they were in previous ages, it's because the game itself has become a source of frustration.

But yea, KoC was pretty cool back in the day cuz it was a chance to meet people from around the world without worrying much about "stranger danger"...although there are the occasional people that still get suckered for money or gifts. But still, the majority of players "get it" and the vicious war part is what made it fun. If you like the people you play with, you won't have a problem getting destroyed.

All I know for certain is that, yea, in a real age people could be nicer to folks without alliance tags that are obviously new and trying to rank. Farming or low hits are no excuse to be a dick to someone or post them up for approval...but I think as far as enforcing things between alliances it's been the same as it always has. If two alliances disagree on a policy, they war until someone gives up or they don't war at all because they are too weak. That's the game.

Semper.Fidelis
14th January 2010, 05:14 PM
People that quit because they get their asses handed to them will quit regardless of what circumstances led to them getting anal-probed. Cause they're quitters. In a war there will always be a winning and a losing side. Can't deal with losing don't play a war game, play some stupid fb crap.

It's not people getting raped for no reason that led to the soon to be demise of this game it was the predictable evolution of gaming itself. The rest of the players who actually want to play a text based browsergame dealing primarily with warfare might have left because KoC changed into KingsOfRecruiters thereby requiring them to spend insane amounts of time to be able and compete for a semi-decent rank.

You can't expect the numbers and individual dedication of WoW in a fucking text based browsergame. There will always be some lost souls, but the rest move on if their hobby takes 10hrs a day to be rewarding fun-wise. That's why.

Want this game to be more attractive to a broad audience, level the playingfield. Get back to Age0 but keep sabbing and boom.

dohh
14th January 2010, 06:17 PM
if you can't handle getting pwned then go play mediwars bitches

Gohon
15th January 2010, 04:22 AM
To be any good at the game you have to put a lot of time and effort into the game. Being sabbed just cause you have joined an alliance is stupid.

But there aint no way to stop it without some really fine tuned code to protect those players who dont deserve to get sabbed while at the same time letting some dick who has 199 nuns and a shit load of spys havin a new arsehole torn for him!!

clans should probably have tighter rules , but noone is gunna get thrown out of a clan for chaining another. especially if he clicks a lot.

BloodBullet
15th January 2010, 04:29 AM
I lost count on how many posts there have been with 'why koc is dying, and how to save it'


seriously people, give up ADMINS WONT LISTEN

ThomasA
15th January 2010, 06:42 AM
I lost count on how many posts there have been with 'why koc is dying, and how to save it'


seriously people, give up ADMINS WONT LISTEN

I think the OP wants players to listen and make the changes.

LordCounter
15th January 2010, 08:38 AM
You're looking for these new players? Hi. I started at the very end of age 12, and almost quit halfway through this beta due to exactly the reasons eden gave. I was being sabbed hardcore for simply being in an alliance that someone got mad at. The only reason I stayed is that my commander is a great guy and covered all my losses for me.

You are right in saying that this isn't the place for intimate relationships, but it is a place where you are supposed to have fun. Getting your ass handed to you for no reason is NOT fun, and say what you want, but the more new players don't have fun, the more they will quit.

and whos fault is it that a new player like yourself can be ownd like that? its the sabbing formula not the player's

maybe its not such a bad idea to get the 50 IS max thing back again. you cant balance a top account's damage with an average or small account anyway

ThomasA
15th January 2010, 10:20 AM
and whos fault is it that a new player like yourself can be ownd like that? its the sabbing formula not the player's

maybe its not such a bad idea to get the 50 IS max thing back again. you cant balance a top account's damage with an average or small account anyway

the formula does not force people to randomly chain for little or no reason or for players to be massed by an alliance caus someone expected to hold their gold for half a day or more or to get massed for someone elses actions. These are player decisions.

What are you suggesting? a formula that calculates what a reasonable hit is? that doesnt allow you to be sabbed unless you have been in their logs in the last 24 hours?

loofa4
15th January 2010, 10:30 AM
and whos fault is it that a new player like yourself can be ownd like that? its the sabbing formula not the player's

maybe its not such a bad idea to get the 50 IS max thing back again. you cant balance a top account's damage with an average or small account anyway

It doesn't matter that it COULD happen, what this thread is about is that it SHOULD not happen. The Geneva Convention idea is good one.

nirvanaisking
15th January 2010, 11:14 AM
I don't think you can introduce a set of organized war rules between alliances because after all this is a game called Kings of CHAOS. I agree that new players are deterred by the total destruction these wars cause and I think it's simply a matter of a new player finding the right alliance to join which is not easy to do. I am not sure how this could be resolved but I don't think taking the destructiveness out of the wars is the best way to do it.

I also agree that the nature of recent wars seems to be based on frustration with the way the game is being changed. Some people react differently to these changes. Some decide to just go sab-happy and others decide to quit and still others, such as myself, decide to just let their beta account deteriorate and wait for the real age to begin.

This beta was a bad time for having destructive wars because people are still trying to figure out the new aspects of the gameplay and it certainly gets frustrating when you have 3 alliances sabbing you while you're just trying to get a feel for how the next age is going to be. I think because of this we're going to see even more uncertainty in the new age than we would have if the beta had been relatively peaceful. All I've been trying to do in this beta is build attack and spy so I could gain experience to see how the new upgrades will affect my playing but it has become impossible because of the endless sabs and the new one turn per minute system.

saulot
15th January 2010, 11:44 AM
I don't think you can introduce a set of organized war rules between alliances because after all this is a game called Kings of CHAOS.

well probably not impossible but all the big alliances wuld have to agre on it and enforce it
and that wuld be vary hard

death frog
15th January 2010, 12:16 PM
Semper.Fidelis i agree 100%. its a war game! if you want to bring back players level the playing field. quit pandering to the top 100 players, unless thats all you want playing the game.

Eden-
15th January 2010, 04:37 PM
I lost count on how many posts there have been with 'why koc is dying, and how to save it'


seriously people, give up ADMINS WONT LISTEN

Did you even read my post? Or just assume that it's another post flaming admins.


I don't think you can introduce a set of organized war rules between alliances because after all this is a game called Kings of CHAOS.

I don't care if this game is called Kings of Pretty Little Pink Kittens. People like you seem to only dispute the fact that because 'chaos' is in the title that the only way to play this game is by destroying everything without remorse. If that were the case, alliances wouldn't exist and it would be every man for himself. But no, the game's name is absolutely irrelevant, and your point has absolutely no credibility. As long as alliances exist, so will politics and diplomacy. But at a point, some civility has been lost and it has damaged this game. And the only players that have the power to try and keep small accounts and new generations from quitting is by creating a sort of Geneva's Convention that alliance players would need the discretion to abide by. It wouldn't be difficult if the members of every alliance respected their leadership, all it takes is one more rule for every leader to agree on. But yeah it's probably something that won't happen, but it is definitely something that would improve the quality of this game.

PalmTree
15th January 2010, 05:00 PM
Actually... this age keeps the game civil... Before there wouldn't be limits on sabs other than what was it... 10 tries? Accounts could be zeroed overnight if you upset someone. There was a 4% sab limit now its 12%. I can keep gaining as much as I lose. Hell ya to that(sucks for the other side). How am I supposed to sab people to zero when there is a 12% loss? The game you are talking about never existed. If you don't want to be a part of politics join a small alliance or leave during war time... As long as I can't get zeroed overnight, its all good to me. Before with 100k people it was easy to just be a "number." Now your forced to be recognized.

Santa87
15th January 2010, 05:31 PM
People that quit because they get their asses handed to them will quit regardless of what circumstances led to them getting anal-probed. Cause they're quitters...

No not really... When people start playing a new game, it takes some time for them to get into the game, and become dedicated, especially when its a free online game. If they have their account destroyed by some war they have nothing to do with, before they have developed the dedication, they will most likely quit, though if they are left alone untill they have become familiar with the ongoings, they are more likely to become loyal to their alliance, fight back, or try to solve it with diplomacy.
I know for a fact that if my account had been totally destroyed after I had played a few weeks, when I first joined, I would have quit the game.
But I was kept out of trouble, and had the change to grow familiar with the game, and its ongoings, and become an active part of an alliance, and then when there finally came a war, I lost almost entire account, but I kept fighting due to loyalty to my alliance.

LordCounter
16th January 2010, 10:42 AM
weird thing is, if you think about it...there used to be a set of warrules most alliances would follow when the sabbing limit in these times was so low it was practically impossible to destroy a big account. now that its so much easier, these war rules are faded and everyone sabs everybody.

probably has something to do with the smaller amount of players, easier to break the rules as theres only a few in your alliance. its not like any alliance can afford it these past ages to kick out an active player

and if the problem lies there, there is not much we can do about it, just adapt i suppose. you cant expect anyone to accept some sort of general manual what to do and not to do in war time. and as i said before a 50 IS max thing wouldnt be such a bad idea as that age wasnt half as crappy as this one. i mean the people that play the top accounts spend all their available time on their accounts, im not too bothered they cant be touched that much. whats the alternative?

Eden-
16th January 2010, 01:06 PM
Well, I wasn't particularly thinking along the lines of having to create some sort of manual with a huge list of rules.. I was more or less thinking about each alliance head creating a list of actively warring players in their alliance. And when wars start, you go after those players and leave the rest alone.

-Eden

nirvanaisking
16th January 2010, 08:07 PM
Did you even read my post? Or just assume that it's another post flaming admins.



I don't care if this game is called Kings of Pretty Little Pink Kittens. People like you seem to only dispute the fact that because 'chaos' is in the title that the only way to play this game is by destroying everything without remorse. If that were the case, alliances wouldn't exist and it would be every man for himself. But no, the game's name is absolutely irrelevant, and your point has absolutely no credibility. As long as alliances exist, so will politics and diplomacy. But at a point, some civility has been lost and it has damaged this game. And the only players that have the power to try and keep small accounts and new generations from quitting is by creating a sort of Geneva's Convention that alliance players would need the discretion to abide by. It wouldn't be difficult if the members of every alliance respected their leadership, all it takes is one more rule for every leader to agree on. But yeah it's probably something that won't happen, but it is definitely something that would improve the quality of this game.

I like how you picked out the one thing i disagreed with you about in my entire post and commented on that rather than where I agreed with you. I said that I do believe wars have gotten out of hand but that some specific set of rules is not the answer.

I was trying to offer some support of your cause making wars reasonable I just don't agree with your means. But if my support is unwanted then leave me out of this.

LordCounter
17th January 2010, 07:40 AM
Well, I wasn't particularly thinking along the lines of having to create some sort of manual with a huge list of rules.. I was more or less thinking about each alliance head creating a list of actively warring players in their alliance. And when wars start, you go after those players and leave the rest alone.

-Eden

lol. so lets say i click 2million links and boost my commander with 1mil soldiers and he uses his tbg to be untouchable and sab you. but you cant sab me cause i didnt directly sab you?

Danny
17th January 2010, 08:23 AM
If anyone had a brain, the new sab thing is like they can take 5% of ur armory a day right, if ur a daily player, you can grow your account more than 5% each day, it's not that hard.

if u dont wanna get sabbed, be out of chain... or just join me. lol

Eden-
17th January 2010, 11:47 PM
LordCounter i'm not even going to respond to that because it is highly irrational and improbable.

Gohon
18th January 2010, 12:56 PM
lol. so lets say i click 2million links and boost my commander with 1mil soldiers and he uses his tbg to be untouchable and sab you. but you cant sab me cause i didnt directly sab you?

What a load of BS.

why not use ur own 2mil soliders to become untouchable???

Semper.Fidelis
18th January 2010, 01:29 PM
Actually LC's example makes perfect sense. It is an exaggeration to show the necessity of the principle "He who shields, harbors or nurishes my enemy is my enemy" in any war, which is NOT equal to "You're either with me or you're my enemy" btw.

Tactics 101...

And Gohan it is astounding how you not only did not get his example but even managed to misunderstand the pretense. rofl...

LordCounter
18th January 2010, 02:31 PM
Actually LC's example makes perfect sense. It is an exaggeration to show the necessity of the principle "He who shields, harbors or nurishes my enemy is my enemy" in any war, which is NOT equal to "You're either with me or you're my enemy" btw.

Tactics 101...

And Gohan it is astounding how you not only did not get his example but even managed to misunderstand the pretense. rofl...

^
what he says

simply pointing out that these manuals dont work. and something that happens almost every age isnt exactly improbable

Bennmann
25th January 2010, 02:34 PM
King of Chaos is a beautiful text based MMO RTS. There is no other MMO RTS like it in scope or complexity. However there are now and in the past year or two free 3D games that attract the same free playing crowd:



That's one of them, as is this:




This is simple supply and demand. The demand for free games is lowered because of market saturation of quality free games. This was not so 5 years ago when the OP was playing with 200,000 other players.

I for one will still come back to KoC on occasion because it is a very unique genre.

Doc
27th January 2010, 09:27 AM
this isnt kings of treehuggers. if you want to have intimate relationships on the internet go e-dating or w/e

and what new players are you talking about anyway, its pretty hard destroying an account that hasnt got any weps cause he just started.

and among those 200k players there were thousands and thousand of fakes and a shit load of ppl that were simply playing koc cause it was the most popular game around. after some years those players leave cause its not that interesting anymore whether they add a 3d function to koc or make nice lil colours w/e .and the fakes are all mostly gone too. i.e 7k players who still like it. and they now get a crappy age cause the admins do shit. i dont give a flying shit the admins made their money already cause we gave it to them and we'd like to see some maintenance of the game we've been playing for so many years. dont come up with bs stories that its the players' fault cause they dont wanna be lil buddies with each other

Lordcounter, Your a prime example of why this game is going down the drain. Your an account wrecker and dont give a monkeys.

fistsofthor
27th January 2010, 01:40 PM
because this is a war game, every player has an army. I don't think your idea will work. However, with the current sab rules, people dont go after as many targets as they did in the old days simply because they run out of turns.

TrailHog
27th January 2010, 06:52 PM
Wow, I played age 1-7 or 8 now it does not look like much going on
Welcome, TrailHog.
You last visited: 29th October 2006 at 07:53 AM
Your Notifications: 1
I had a bit of a laugh out of my last login...

LordCounter
27th January 2010, 07:16 PM
Lordcounter, Your a prime example of why this game is going down the drain. Your an account wrecker and dont give a monkeys.

lol yea right ive been playing the way i do since age 4 and now im a prime example why this game is going down the drain. id love to take credit for 200k ppl leaving but no

TrailHog
27th January 2010, 07:29 PM
lol yea right ive been playing the way i do since age 4 and now im a prime example why this game is going down the drain. id love to take credit for 200k ppl leaving but no


Lol you are a Account wrecker huh... I always thought that was the point of KOC : ) I was in a sab alliance most of my time in KOC I left because the game became limited and no fun due to the whiners. I remember the wrath of DN81 and his group os sabers ahhh those were the days

dohh
27th January 2010, 07:46 PM
Lordcounter, Your a prime example of why this game is going down the drain. Your an account wrecker and dont give a monkeys.
#1: You're a prime example of why no one likes LaCN and why this game is going down the drain... :punch:

This is a war game, KINGS of CHAOS, perhaps you have heard of it, it's where you're allowed to attack and sab whoever you want for any or no reason... that's why it's in the game, otherwise Rocco should just remove attacking and sabbing altogether.

With the username "Doc", talking like a retard (Red_LaCN style), and being so firmly attached at the nose to LaCN's asshole I'm going to assume you are "Murdoc", in which case good luck with your internet wife. If I'm wrong, well, I don't really care anyways. :) cy@!

#2: TLDR on original post. I'm just going to assume this thread mainly consists of wah wah wah wah wah all the changes suckl there's only 100 players omg wah wah wah... so do something about it. Either suck it up, keep playing and email Rocco to try to change things for the better... or quit.

Even though I think most of the changes were shitty and pointless this age, I did my part spamming Rocco to try and change it. Plus I can even still have fun playing KoC because it's not my job like some people, I don't worry about breaking KoC Geneva convention rule #9734 every time I load someones stat page.

- doh out

TLDR version:
1. LaCN sucks
2. Doc don't try to get big with LC
3. if you don't like something email Rocco@kingsofchaos.com or quit and go play mediwars
4. stop playing like it's your job. you have way more fun when you don't care and do what you want
5. cry more

fistsofthor
27th January 2010, 08:11 PM
Lordcounter, Your a prime example of why this game is going down the drain. Your an account wrecker and dont give a monkeys.

I disagree. If we had 20 or 30 more players like LC, then the game would be a good deal better off.

Orhan_knight
30th January 2010, 05:32 AM
I disagree. If we had 20 or 30 more players like LC, then the game would be a good deal better off.

Not true if you would have followed the beta, then u would have seen that there were alot of random sabbers lol :D

And who are you to tell how LC should play this game?

Tapchou
30th January 2010, 11:11 AM
Not true if you would have followed the beta, then u would have seen that there were alot of random sabberslol :D

And who are you to tell how LC should play this game?

That's what the game is all about, go learn to play, dude.

Sh4nnon
30th January 2010, 01:18 PM
doc is not murdoc .. murdoc is murdoc .. doc in not lacn .. if you think he is provide proof... if all u can say is he whines and hence he is lacn .. i can carry the argument forward and say he is tfe/lgc/tffirm/nwo/rf/dl/ts/tg or any other ... and i wonder when people will stop complaining about play styles .. everyone has his own some like to sab , some slay , some rank . let them do that lol ...

fistsofthor
30th January 2010, 03:29 PM
I disagree. If we had 20 or 30 more players like LC, then the game would be a good deal better off.


Not true if you would have followed the beta, then u would have seen that there were alot of random sabbers lol :D

And who are you to tell how LC should play this game?

um, the random sabbers made this game more fun, not less fun.

1) where o where did I tell LC how to play?
2) I am fistsofthor. And, FYI, im considering getting up to 200 nuns and maxing out my spy upgrade and then just going and sabbing people-- maybe solo people, maybe chains, i haven't decided yet.

@sh4nnon: Woah. You forgot the most important logic of all: Doc makes posts that someone doesn't like, therefore he must be me.
/sarcasm

Orhan_knight
31st January 2010, 12:33 AM
That's what the game is all about, go learn to play, dude.


maybe u should learn to read?

ThomasA
31st January 2010, 12:46 AM
Lets keep the posts constructive and on topic plz

elvsking
3rd April 2010, 11:43 AM
So far, I only watched but now I think I'll will answer to this post.

people complain that all players go, but is normal for players to leave. Nobody lives for a game. The question is why there are no new players?
And the answer is simpler who want to play this game? What sense is to play a game if you know you will never be on top. You realy think a new player can have 10 milions TFF in an age? You think a player have a chance against all the aliances?

They are a lot of problems in this game starting with idiots who think they are invincible, players who are mentally retarded (just look what language they use), how can a new player survive whe is sab, farm, blakmailed? And whe need to remember they a lot of games on the internet not only KOC.

I think this game is dead no longer makes sense to invest in it. How long does it tolerate abuses from players on other players did not even make sense to talk of something else.

There are many problems that do not deserve more discussion, but I remember a few:

1. [DH] as long as they do what they whant are going to discourage players (and other aliance like them).
2. Wy you play if you can not win.
3. Lack of involvement of the Administrator can not even report a player who blackmail you.
4. many scripts and here give only one example http://shane.skaro.ws/ac/

The list can go on forever. If this game wants to be saved and to come back to his former glory.

g0rFz-
3rd April 2010, 11:53 AM
i think for the hell of it next age should be a "throwback" like the earlier earlier ages <age5 or maybe like age 9 with crazy wars.

ArxSerpens
3rd April 2010, 01:34 PM
4. many scripts and here give only one example http://shane.skaro.ws/ac/


Wow, of all the 'scripts' this age in KoC, you pick the legal one? Lol, funny. AutomaticCreations is a newer, improved style of IRIS, which was legal and used in age 4/5 I think? Up until PR lost its coders and merged with other chains. Then it was the x name one, cant remember what it was called. But either way, its not the first. So it and stuff like it has been legal for a few years in KoC use.

Might want to find a better example.

A_A
3rd April 2010, 02:48 PM
i guess he never said it was illegal.. he just said its a cause for koc dying in his opinion

LordCounter
3rd April 2010, 05:33 PM
which ive to agree to. koc is pretty boring with these scripts. no trouble for a slayer it just makes it too easy, less attractive. searching for a while, checking your farms gives a more satisfied feeling than just pressing his stats links and getting the gold
i think they should all be illegal cause it makes koc too easy for slayers. another reason why there are no big slaying accounts this age - it isnt all that exciting

Semper.Fidelis
4th April 2010, 01:54 AM
I think scripts pale in comparison to the contribution of the offie bonus when it comes to the dropping player base. That was by far the most retarded change since the introduction of morale transfers. Those 2 alone unlevel the playingfield in such an enormous way a newly registered players invests 2 weeks into their account and get the feeling they will never be able to even compete for #100, so why even bother investing time.
You see a ton of people with millions in tff when you start out with 50 and they get 10 times the stats for every BPM you get, that is about as encouraging as genital herpes, I imagine. Hell it even pisses me off and I don't have a shitty newly registered account.
You wanna save the game, get rid of the retarded changes unleveling the playing field and discourging every noob from even giving it a try and it'll save itsself.
If the game had been like this when I first came across it in Age0, I wouldn't have bothered and I'm pretty sure most of us wouldn't have...

DrunKnGoblin
4th April 2010, 02:57 AM
which ive to agree to. koc is pretty boring with these scripts. no trouble for a slayer it just makes it too easy, less attractive. searching for a while, checking your farms gives a more satisfied feeling than just pressing his stats links and getting the gold
i think they should all be illegal cause it makes koc too easy for slayers. another reason why there are no big slaying accounts this age - it isnt all that exciting

Yea i agree, Scripts negate a lot of reason for players to have sentry. They might Get 80 bil and think they r safe, no1 can see there gold, Just takes one account to recon and every1 knows what they are holding.

and to muppet:
1. [DH] as long as they do what they whant are going to discourage players (and other aliance like them).

Granted we probably have made a few players quit.
How about all the big alliances out there who tell you how much your allowed to steal and how often. Extorting morale out of little players with threats of approval.
We are the other side of the table, Hit for what ever, when ever. If admins wanted me to hit u once evry 24 hours, im sure they would limit attacks to 1 a day not 10.

ZAR
4th April 2010, 03:45 PM
I agree with Morale transfers and officerbonus being unfun and probably driving a lot people away - XP is nice but needs to be tweaked and I really think shorter Ages can promote more activity.

elvsking
5th April 2010, 03:49 AM
4. many scripts and here give only one example http://shane.skaro.ws/ac/


Wow, of all the 'scripts' this age in KoC, you pick the legal one? Lol, funny. AutomaticCreations is a newer, improved style of IRIS, which was legal and used in age 4/5 I think? Up until PR lost its coders and merged with other chains. Then it was the x name one, cant remember what it was called. But either way, its not the first. So it and stuff like it has been legal for a few years in KoC use.

Might want to find a better example.

This is a good exemple is a legal script but give a avantage to some players. I know thier are a lot of scripts, PR, LordStriker LACN, LOP all the big aliances have scripts but thei use them INCHAIN. A big player have the spay and the ability to recon first and don't need a script for this, but a new player? Use this script for top rank players and is not a problem but not for all, give new players a chance.



Yea i agree, Scripts negate a lot of reason for players to have sentry. They might Get 80 bil and think they r safe, no1 can see there gold, Just takes one account to recon and every1 knows what they are holding.

and to muppet:
1. [DH] as long as they do what they whant are going to discourage players (and other aliance like them).

Granted we probably have made a few players quit.
How about all the big alliances out there who tell you how much your allowed to steal and how often. Extorting morale out of little players with threats of approval.
We are the other side of the table, Hit for what ever, when ever. If admins wanted me to hit u once evry 24 hours, im sure they would limit attacks to 1 a day not 10.

You do the same, you "Extorting morale out of little players with threats of" sabing is the same. I don't refer of attacking you can attack anyoane but don't sab if a player have 1000 TFF and 100 BPM and you sab 10 of them that player will probabili quit. The math is very simple if you make 10 players quit is more logical to ban you and then will be 9 players more in the games.

If you want to make the games more dinamic and to get more playes in, limit the sab, put an end to sab acounts. I know a lot of players who quit KOC because of sab accounts.

The experience is a good thing but don't give a bonus for officers this only descurage players, and give the experinte to the player that win this will make recon important.

DrunKnGoblin
5th April 2010, 05:43 AM
This is a good exemple is a legal script but give a avantage to some players. I know thier are a lot of scripts, PR, LordStriker LACN, LOP all the big aliances have scripts but thei use them INCHAIN. A big player have the spay and the ability to recon first and don't need a script for this, but a new player? Use this script for top rank players and is not a problem but not for all, give new players a chance.




You do the same, you "Extorting morale out of little players with threats of" sabing is the same. I don't refer of attacking you can attack anyoane but don't sab if a player have 1000 TFF and 100 BPM and you sab 10 of them that player will probabili quit. The math is very simple if you make 10 players quit is more logical to ban you and then will be 9 players more in the games.

If you want to make the games more dinamic and to get more playes in, limit the sab, put an end to sab acounts. I know a lot of players who quit KOC because of sab accounts.

The experience is a good thing but don't give a bonus for officers this only descurage players, and give the experinte to the player that win this will make recon important.

Ok We dont go extorting little players, The little players get a few little sabs and some friendly pm's advising them to break chain if they enjoy having an account that grows.

I totally agree with offy bonus, Biggest fail koc has had, promotes fakes, Splits game into categories, making it very hard for independant players without at least 5 offies to do anything. They need 50% more weapons.

"If you want to make the games more dinamic and to get more playes in, limit the sab, put an end to sab acounts. I know a lot of players who quit KOC because of sab accounts."

Maybe koc isn't your thing man, Im sure disney or neopets website have something that may be more in your court, Leave war games to the big kids.
Its easy to point the finger at the mighty DH/DT for dwindling numbers (maybe we pwnd you too at some point) But most the people i know who have left this game between age 2 and now have left because they have found something else to do or they just werent happy with koc seeming to get worse and worse every age.

Now i like how much effort rocco has put into this age, He just needs to listen to some feedback and make a few tweaks and changes.

Ages 4/5 had some of the largest number of players of any ages played and they were the ages of the sab alliances, So maybe its the opposite, Not enough sab chains, too many wussy diplomatic sissies who hide behind their alliances.

Lopina
5th April 2010, 05:47 AM
Remove offie bonus, limit morale transfers, tweak sab damage in a way that the more you destroy from others, more can be destroyed from you.

ZAR
5th April 2010, 06:49 AM
Remove offie bonus, limit morale transfers, tweak sab damage in a way that the more you destroy from others, more can be destroyed from you.

I forgot the sablimits - how could I :)

Id say the aats need to be dynamic - small and midleranged accounts need a bit more protection in that matter, big accounts need to be sabbable by more - maybe base aats on value and have top accounts more vulnerable? Also get rid of the 15% limit and make it so that 1 weapon is always sabbable.

LordCounter
5th April 2010, 07:15 AM
This is a good exemple is a legal script but give a avantage to some players. I know thier are a lot of scripts, PR, LordStriker LACN, LOP all the big aliances have scripts but thei use them INCHAIN. A big player have the spay and the ability to recon first and don't need a script for this, but a new player? Use this script for top rank players and is not a problem but not for all, give new players a chance.




You do the same, you "Extorting morale out of little players with threats of" sabing is the same. I don't refer of attacking you can attack anyoane but don't sab if a player have 1000 TFF and 100 BPM and you sab 10 of them that player will probabili quit. The math is very simple if you make 10 players quit is more logical to ban you and then will be 9 players more in the games.

If you want to make the games more dinamic and to get more playes in, limit the sab, put an end to sab acounts. I know a lot of players who quit KOC because of sab accounts.

The experience is a good thing but don't give a bonus for officers this only descurage players, and give the experinte to the player that win this will make recon important.

lol you are funny. now, when you type the koc site , do you srite Kings of Treehuggers or Kingsofchaos.com? sab is part of koc and it has ALWAYS been like that. well except one age but still. sabbers have always been there as well and they are actually getting butt raped these last few ages. sabbers are limited in so many ways now, turns, high aats, SA that can be sabbed, gay exp and conquests that cost turns like wtf do turns grow on my back? now the reason why im not calling you names now is because you are probably new to his game but please, dotn accuse sabbers of random things that they are in no way responsible for. a sabber's goal is to make ppl leave chain, if they do so theres no way they continue sabbers so its just bs.

elvsking
5th April 2010, 07:49 AM
lol you are funny. now, when you type the koc site , do you srite Kings of Treehuggers or Kingsofchaos.com? sab is part of koc and it has ALWAYS been like that. well except one age but still. sabbers have always been there as well and they are actually getting butt raped these last few ages. sabbers are limited in so many ways now, turns, high aats, SA that can be sabbed, gay exp and conquests that cost turns like wtf do turns grow on my back? now the reason why im not calling you names now is because you are probably new to his game but please, dotn accuse sabbers of random things that they are in no way responsible for. a sabber's goal is to make ppl leave chain, if they do so theres no way they continue sabbers so its just bs.

First of all I'm plaing for Age 0, some Ages more then other. I'm not a new player, but this in not important. I will not start argue with you, is not on topic. If you aloud spy acounts a player will only invest in spy and nothing else, this player will only use turns for sab. I never seen the fun in sab acounts but if a player whant to play like that is his problem. But limit the range of spy acounts, is not fair for a big player to sab a new player give that player a chance to play. Find a metot to limit sab acounts not sab in general, and give new players a chance to play, or the players will continue to leave and the game will remain without players.

DrunKnGoblin
5th April 2010, 07:50 AM
Remove offie bonus, limit morale transfers, tweak sab damage in a way that the more you destroy from others, more can be destroyed from you.

hmm i like the remove offy bonus, limiting morale transfers, but with sabbing more and more being sabbed from you, It would need to be a good formulae, i can see it going real bad in the way of sabbers if they don't get it right.
I spose you could just rename the site kingsofdiplomacy if it does happen.
But i like the idea in theory, i just cant think of how a 'FAIR' formulae could be worked out.

and LC always preaching wisdom as usual
<3


EDIT:
"is not fair for a big player to sab a new player give that player a chance to play. Find a metot to limit sab acounts not sab in general, and give new players a chance to play, or the players will continue to leave and the game will remain without players."
the only arguement u have i agree with, But remember new accounts are unsabbable with up to 199 weapons. after that they lose 1 AAT. That is pretty good sab immunity.
Sabbers have always played like this, Sabbing the little accounts has always been a major part of our battle plan. Give them the choice to change to another clan or outgrow us.

As you said "If you aloud spy acounts a player will only invest in spy and nothing else, this player will only use turns for sab." If this is the case, how much of a nub are you if you got all your turns to use to outgrow them, Where they can only rely on TBG which if they hit sab limits anything bought after that will get sabbed anyway. making growth near on impossible even if you did sell morale.
Ok there are my thoughts...
pull your skirt up and have some fun.

Lopina
5th April 2010, 09:27 AM
but with sabbing more and more being sabbed from you, It would need to be a good formulae, i can see it going real bad in the way of sabbers if they don't get it right.


Well, that's the general idea. But on the other hand, we've all seen how successful rocco is with creating formulas ;)

LordCounter
5th April 2010, 02:00 PM
But limit the range of spy acounts, is not fair for a big player to sab a new player give that player a chance to play. Find a metot to limit sab acounts not sab in general, and give new players a chance to play, or the players will continue to leave and the game will remain without players.

lil buddy, no one sabs small accounts cause it cost too many turns. small accounts are extremely, extremely, extremely well protected so i really dont see the problem here.
ive played a sab account for many ages now, and this is the first age i actually got sabbed more than i sabbed myself. my account is constantly crap cause i can not build up cause of the lack of turns. how in gods name do you want to limit sab accounts any further? make them lose spy every time they sab someone? oh wait that already happens you lose tools when sabbing for some reason. :icon_idio

AznCrusad3r
11th July 2010, 11:56 AM
Things haven't changed much since I left I see.

What this game needs to survive is community. How to achieve this community is more mod presence on the forums, which results in the civility you wanted to see. Civility ingame is useless. We used to see mods post here very often, and sometimes even joining in the discussions. It also restricts obvious flamebaiting (ahem, LordCounter?) to a minimum.

Making wars have greater consequences on nations would help too. The greater the consequences, the greater the risk of your nation being destroyed, so people will play a more defensive game.

xjkryex
12th July 2010, 11:15 PM
Are you serious... Im sick of this "more defensive game" that KoC has already became... do you remember how fun it was when wars consisted of thousands of players and sab alliances existed in order to keep alliances in check? This is Kings of CHAOS which most people forget. Sabbers don't make the game worse, they help keep what is left of the game in balance. Otherwise SC or PR would have ruled KoC from the beginning. There are few grouos that are still able to keep the larger alliances in check. So stop complaining about sabbing, its part of the game, its not against the rules... get over it?

LittleMonster
13th July 2010, 10:20 AM
Seems like a pretty easy fix:

1. Make things easier for the newbie who just made his account. He cant see gold and he cant defeat anyone even if he buys attack weapons. Maybe start everyone with 1 spy tool so they can see the gold of people who didnt buy any sentry. How come when a new account attacks someone with no DA weapons they still lose? That needs to be changed so when a newbie creates his account he can actually attack someone and take their gold.

2. Prize and Advertise? Why not advertise KoC on the web or other gaming sites (or 'bored-at-work' sites) to give a player boost, this would work best if there was a prize offered for 1st.

3. Shorter ages. So many reasons. Why would someone start 3 months into the age with any hope of ranking? Who likes to play such long ages? Shorter ages means more intensity, more warring, more fun with fewer repercussions, more options. Everyone complains about the sab formula, if ages were 1-2 months I doubt people would be so upset if their account got trashed.

4. Stop banning people for personal reasons and stop demanding everyone to go to IRC to plead their case. Be open with the player base and tell them why they were banned instead of ignoring their PMs and e-mails.

MFnBonsai
13th July 2010, 11:34 AM
4. Stop banning people for personal reasons and stop demanding everyone to go to IRC to plead their case. Be open with the player base and tell them why they were banned instead of ignoring their PMs and e-mails.

I havent seen any personal reason bannings although I havent been that active but I am getting back into it....

Players that get banned have a chance to appeal their ban and often it is easier for mods to request them to go to IRC to be able to discuss the reasons why they were banned.... rocco doesnt really deal with bannings so emails to him often do not get replies....

Mods deal with the bans and suspensions and appeals.... admins deal with the game....

There is a certain level of privacy to someones account which is why the player base doesnt always know who gets banned and why.... Which is also why if someone comes and asks why so and so was banned the mods dont discuss it with them.... Although some feel that an account in an alliance belongs to that alliance and are obligated to have a response given or blah blah he/she was an officer so the commander has to know why.... but really we do not have to discuss it with anyone but the account holder....

Hibun_th
13th July 2010, 12:10 PM
I havent seen any personal reason bannings although I havent been that active but I am getting back into it....

Players that get banned have a chance to appeal their ban and often it is easier for mods to request them to go to IRC to be able to discuss the reasons why they were banned.... rocco doesnt really deal with bannings so emails to him often do not get replies....

Mods deal with the bans and suspensions and appeals.... admins deal with the game....

There is a certain level of privacy to someones account which is why the player base doesnt always know who gets banned and why.... Which is also why if someone comes and asks why so and so was banned the mods dont discuss it with them.... Although some feel that an account in an alliance belongs to that alliance and are obligated to have a response given or blah blah he/she was an officer so the commander has to know why.... but really we do not have to discuss it with anyone but the account holder....

Remco told LaCN why i was banned even before i talked to him about it. and once i did i asked him to look into it (my appeal) and he never answered me back.

Im not going to fight him (he's a mod and i cant do anything about the bans) but just dont say the system is more fair than it truly is.

<3 remco.

Blankslate
13th July 2010, 12:24 PM
Lol i been playing since age 1 and here are a few things i have noticed

1) People hate that there is a sab cap on players ( Makes the small annoying people almost in-vincible )
2) Not enough advertisement
3) You basically banned Recruiting ingame
4) You have too big of chains. ( If a n00bie little player does something wrong, you have an entire chain on them..... ) Kinda discuraging to play when u dont know what ur doing and u get mad raped by all the players because you where "" Farming"" which also comes into $5
5) Too many rules set by the players, there should be a set of direct guidelines. ( Like back in ages 1-2 ) Before all the alliance / sub-alliances where formed.
6) People forgot this was a "WAR GAME" not a "BANKERS GAME"

here are just some idea's that might help that i have seen change.

Hibun_th
13th July 2010, 12:59 PM
skorpz is saving the game right now by rouging.

Poseidon-SR
15th July 2010, 01:15 AM
Lol i been playing since age 1 and here are a few things i have noticed

Ah another vet like me ^^



1) People hate that there is a sab cap on players ( Makes the small annoying people almost in-vincible )

No sab-cap means total destruction of an account; that doesnt invite me to come play KoC either ..



2) Not enough advertisement

True, but nowadays almost every website asks money for advertising; who's gonna pay that? (donations to KoC may help..)



3) You basically banned Recruiting ingame

Oh yeash; recruiting is too limited



4) You have too big of chains. ( If a n00bie little player does something wrong, you have an entire chain on them..... ) Kinda discuraging to play when u dont know what ur doing and u get mad raped by all the players because you where "" Farming"" which also comes into $5

True, but limiting chainsize isnt very encouraging either



5) Too many rules set by the players, there should be a set of direct guidelines. ( Like back in ages 1-2 ) Before all the alliance / sub-alliances where formed.

Yeah, made by admins, not players



6) People forgot this was a "WAR GAME" not a "BANKERS GAME"

Hmm yeah but when your account is too big, you dont have much targets ...

Sh4nnon
15th July 2010, 04:09 PM
may be linking the game with few of the social networking sites(like facebook could help ?)

H2SO4
26th July 2010, 02:13 AM
I too have been here since Age 1... nothing changes, still the same old arguments...

FallenOne
7th August 2010, 03:22 AM
the game is dying because people move onto other things.
boredom, wanting something new, too busy.

Miro
22nd August 2010, 12:08 PM
That and KoC doesn't have a good method to fill those empty spots with new and interested players,

speeritthorn
22nd August 2010, 03:35 PM
Another problem with this game is ones ability to change ones name and completely become invisible to those who have learned to keep him out of their alliance. Thats the internet for you. they should display a link to a players previous aliases under their current name.

Also, at the original topic, the problem in kings of chaos is not the CHAOS, braindead. Its the frickin CLICKING. what a stupid idea, and everyone has EATEN IT UP. To be good, you have to click whether for morale or to sell morale. You HAVE to click or you arent worth **** in this game. Now, to make that the case, you have just turned off the reason for thousands more to play. Who wants to get on and be expected to click a string of random images to succeed?

And more to the point, even if you click 10000 images, and sell all the morale, it doesn't get you ANYWHERE for long, unless you do the same tomorrow. If i posted on facebook for my friends to click 1000 images in a row, let alone 10000, they would be disgusted. AND YET people here on KOC gauge each other by how fast they click, or how much. What a PATHETIC idea. What a PATHETIC concept. And if im PATHETIC for saying so, oh well. I have MUCH better things to do than click a strand of images written in stars. I don't mean in real life. I mean like attacking, and warring. Fighting for my money, not CLICKING IMAGES for it. I think anyone who invests the time in this.... well never mind, i have good friends who do. So ill keep my mouth shut.

The day kings of chaos started the clicking system was the day it TRULY died. The day it made the game DEPENDENT on it, it put the last nail in its coffin. Nuff said.

LordCounter
22nd August 2010, 03:43 PM
Another problem with this game is ones ability to change ones name and completely become invisible to those who have learned to keep him out of their alliance. Thats the internet for you. they should display a link to a players previous aliases under their current name.

Also, at the original topic, the problem in kings of chaos is not the CHAOS, braindead. Its the frickin CLICKING. what a stupid idea, and everyone has EATEN IT UP. To be good, you have to click whether for morale or to sell morale. You HAVE to click or you arent worth **** in this game. Now, to make that the case, you have just turned off the reason for thousands more to play. Who wants to get on and be expected to click a string of random images to succeed?

And more to the point, even if you click 10000 images, and sell all the morale, it doesn't get you ANYWHERE for long, unless you do the same tomorrow. If i posted on facebook for my friends to click 1000 images in a row, let alone 10000, they would be disgusted. AND YET people here on KOC gauge each other by how fast they click, or how much. What a PATHETIC idea. What a PATHETIC concept. And if im PATHETIC for saying so, oh well. I have MUCH better things to do than click a strand of images written in stars. I don't mean in real life. I mean like attacking, and warring. Fighting for my money, not CLICKING IMAGES for it. I think anyone who invests the time in this.... well never mind, i have good friends who do. So ill keep my mouth shut.

The day kings of chaos started the clicking system was the day it TRULY died. The day it made the game DEPENDENT on it, it put the last nail in its coffin. Nuff said.

right. so the day the clicking system started koc died. that confuses me because koc was nothing more than clicking each other's link to begin with.... the rest was all added later. you should have put that moronic 'nuff said' on the start of your post i suppose.

speeritthorn
22nd August 2010, 03:59 PM
Just because thats how it started doesnt make it a good thing... But i actually didnt know that, thanks for the history lesson, no sarcasm intended.

But to follow up, and with help from lordcounters post, it is true, clicking perhaps does have its place, but not as the mass production it is today. I understood having someone clicking your name, you get a troop. cool.

Maybe morale is the bad thing.

LordCounter
22nd August 2010, 05:29 PM
Just because thats how it started doesnt make it a good thing... But i actually didnt know that, thanks for the history lesson, no sarcasm intended.

But to follow up, and with help from lordcounters post, it is true, clicking perhaps does have its place, but not as the mass production it is today. I understood having someone clicking your name, you get a troop. cool.

Maybe morale is the bad thing.

id say the bad thing would be autoclickers...people spending so much time clicking while others just have a program getting them millions of clicks. clicking isnt that bad but if you are in a competition where the standard is a mini cooper and people drive around in a formula one car its getting difficult to win lol, why bother even starting? and because you can not compensate clicking with slaying cause of the turns/sabbable BPMs and BF policies its becoming a pretty hopeless fight. because the mods cant possibly control cheating no matter how active they are, clicking indeed should be getting rid of if the gameplay doesnt change. and then at the end of my post i realize this is yet again another waste of space cause nothing will change anyway lol

speeritthorn
22nd August 2010, 10:21 PM
Youre right. The autoclickers do make it unfair, even i can see that.
But how can they possibly work...?