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View Full Version : Dislike what the admins have done to this age?



Fianor
5th October 2007, 09:21 PM
I know I can't stand it. I hate the game now.

Why has KoC done so well in it's type of game while other have either failed, or not done very well at all? Alliances. We make friends, we want to help each other out, and we make enemies that we want to kill. That's the heart and soul of KoC that other click games don't have. The ability to wage war to help each other, or kill each other, or just because we like the fight. It's the wars that keep the game going.

They've destroyed the one thing that keeps their game alive. The ability to defend yourself and wage war. So many people are just quitting the game and I can't blame them. There are people who aren't sabbers and really don't even like sabbing, big names that almost all of you would recognize, that are talking about quitting the game. Not because they can't sab, but because no one can defend themselves in any way.

We have a few options on what to do about it.

1) shut up and let it suck, click a lot and play a slayer account until everyone not playing slayer quits and we have no more targets to slay

2) quit the game and find another

3) Don't give up, but let the admins know how unhappy we are.


Personally I like the 3rd option. I think they will come around and fix the game if they are forced to see how bad this is. Sure we can continue to
"whine" on here and in IRC, but they don't seem to be listening. Both rocco and aman have KoC accounts, we could message them in game, I doubt they'll pay attention to that either. We can send emails, which will most likely also not get acted upon. While all of these are viable ways to let them know how dissatisfied we are, they are not likely to work, because none of them affect the admins.

However, they can be affected. They make money, as I understand it at least enough to pay college tuitions at MIT, off the ads. When do the ads really come up? When you click. They make a ton of money off of our clicking. I suggest we all STOP.

STOP clicking, if we don't click, they don't get money, if they don't get money, they'll be forced to fix the problem. Do not reward them for breaking the game by continuing to pay them for it. STOP IT. If no one clicks for a couple of days, they'll fix it. They want us to play, they want us to click. We want them to pay attention and fix the game. As they are showing no signs of listening to us now, I think we should all give them a good reason to listen.

IF YOU DON'T LIKE THIS AGE, STATE IT HERE, SEND THEM MESSAGES AND MOST IMPORTANTLY


STOP CLICKING!

Kartel
5th October 2007, 09:56 PM
i thought i was the only one i already stopped clicking this age mabe i will just do it for my officers when they ask but not for me and i would like them to stop clicking too if u ask me

Stop Clicking

age 8 Sux

Karina
5th October 2007, 09:57 PM
Well, maybe they are listening? I heard through the grapevine Rocco is meeting with the sabbers (not sure which sabbers tho) in a room the sabbers have set up to discuss the sab stuff...you could always ask one of the sab chains which channel...that has been a big issue and maybe finally will be revised and reworked.

Fianor
5th October 2007, 10:06 PM
If it is, I'll start clicking again. But until then, I'm not, and I suggest everyone who's unhappy about the age doesn't click either.

Greek-Empire
5th October 2007, 10:10 PM
Look top ranking discussion some good news.This fool age is ending in 3 months (if they end it quicker its better for everyone!).

Smitty
6th October 2007, 12:14 AM
I for one will stop clicking as of 20 minutes ago. I received 223 credits and got screwed out of 123 which could not be submitted and it took over three hours to get them.

I give up with that shit.

sabalot
6th October 2007, 02:26 AM
I do have a question. Everyone is b&^%$ing and moaning about sabbing getting worse and u just said the game is based around sabbing. WTF are u talking about u know the age that lost the most players was ....guess which one ...oh yah the one that added sabbing. :O Now i like sabbing but u keep saying they ruined it by making sabbing worse. And yet they lost prob more players in one age due to sabbing than they have since to everything else :/ kinda wierd....... ssssssssoooooooooo ppppppplllllllzzzzzzzzz quit complianing and move on i have and i love sabing as u can see. it is just a game and just like any new lvl in a game halo 1 to halo 3 it is diff and u have to adapt. so plz stfu

stonewall
6th October 2007, 04:01 AM
the age that lost the most player was age 2 ?

Fianor
6th October 2007, 07:31 AM
I do have a question. Everyone is b&^%$ing and moaning about sabbing getting worse and u just said the game is based around sabbing. WTF are u talking about u know the age that lost the most players was ....guess which one ...oh yah the one that added sabbing. :O Now i like sabbing but u keep saying they ruined it by making sabbing worse. And yet they lost prob more players in one age due to sabbing than they have since to everything else :/ kinda wierd....... ssssssssoooooooooo ppppppplllllllzzzzzzzzz quit complianing and move on i have and i love sabing as u can see. it is just a game and just like any new lvl in a game halo 1 to halo 3 it is diff and u have to adapt. so plz stfu

First, the age which lost the most players was age 3, not 2. Sabbing was introduced in age 2, and removed completely at the beginning of age 3 beta. A LOT of people simply quit then and never came back. They added it back in and a lot more poeple who weren't playing atm because it was a beta also lost interest and never came back. The beta that was supposed to be a short month or 2 turned out to be far to long and that cost us players aslo.

Then the admins actually did scans and looked for fakes and multis. When they cleared all those out, we were left with a # that appeared to be FAR fewer players, when really it was just a lot less fake accounts.

I'm not denying that sabbing has also cost them players. That's their own fault also however. By setting up so that you can make an untouchable and very powerful sab account they are also running players off.

I've stated this many times. We need a way to wage war, and EVERY ACCOUNT needs to be vulnerable to significant damage. EVERY SINGLE ONE. If you can create the untouchable sab accounts like we've had for the last few ages, that's a problem. Covert tools should be sabbable. If you have an account that has ratings and ranks so high that few can hurt it, combined with sab percentages that make it so that any sabbing you do to it is completely irrelevant, that's a problem also. I'm not saying 5 little sabbers that decide to be dicks should be able to take #1 out of the game in one day, far from it. But 20 dedicated sabbers making full runs on #1 daily going unchecked should be very very painful to the account.

Either way, I'm watching players, sabbers, rankers, and even a few slayers all drop out of the game like flies all around me. From every alliance, big chain clicking alliances as well as small solitary players alike. If the admins don't fix this, we won't have KoC to play anymore.

Soldier_Worst
6th October 2007, 02:57 PM
Well, maybe they are listening? I heard through the grapevine Rocco is meeting with the sabbers (not sure which sabbers tho) in a room the sabbers have set up to discuss the sab stuff...you could always ask one of the sab chains which channel...that has been a big issue and maybe finally will be revised and reworked.

That would be one step to another mistake again. All party's have to be involved in a discussion about changes. I don't know anything about this meeting, so I don't know who organised it, if it will work, what will happen, what the goal is, ...

The best result is a well prepared discussion with people who are able to see and understand other players' point of view, not the kind who only thinks self centered. Not the kind who likes sabotage completly out of this game, or the kind who wants to be able a top 100 account by himself. Anway, If there's something coming out of this, we'll hear from it again I'm sure.

I obviously support the idea of making everyone vulnerable, and add more action into the game instead of less, but I'd prefer an alternative on making tools sabbable. There are many interesting possibilities, going from making the old mass attack more efficient, more casualties and add tooldamage. Could be something completly different too, there are plenty of acceptable ideas to be found on GUA.

Nights_Judgement
6th October 2007, 09:38 PM
I've kept my nose out of it because I know I'll always get "Oh, you're Rank #1 and it doens't matter what you think" and because I think contrary to this thread then I know I'll get the whip, but I am just fed up of you guys complaining that you actually have to try and put in some elbow grease to be able to compete now...oh my...now you can't just play a shitty little spy account and chain sab everyone in the game...now you have to play hard to do more damage...oh dear...how unfair....

I agree that Sab Turns should be taken out....that's not really cool

I think that it should be changed from 1:2 to 1:3

I think that there should be a minimum you can sab - maybe just 1 weapon but still have that minimum.

I think the percentage currently is fine at 0.1% , if you're goin to change it, you can't really put it much higher than 0.2 - 0.3% , anyone who disagrees go and do some maths on that and middle ranged accounts before just rolling your tongue.

I think that if you're going to increase the 0.1% , you need to have a maximum that can be sabbed. Maybe 200-500 weapons a go.

Probably give Elves either a cheaper Nunchaku, they don't lose tools, or increase the spy bonus to 40%.


I think those changes would be nice to see for Sabotage, but anyone who claims that sabotage has been completely nerfed truely has not thought about the maths in it, I am pretty sure a big chain of medium sized accounts (really not hard to make a medium all-round account in the top 300-500 ranks these days) could really lay waste mid-age to most mid-sized accounts that make up a normal alliance. All you need is 100 successful sabs to reduce their entire account value down by 10%. And since the success rate has been inceased if you can get in, that only really needs about 20-30 people sabbing. Losing 10% of your Top 100-200 account everyday for a week even will reduce you to practically withers and very likely out of the alliance you're in and hence weakening the chainhead. Someone who spends a long time working on there account can have their account really decimated by making it a % instead of a set value.

N00bs can't really be hurt that much with this rule (good for the new comers to get a chance to come in)

The top top ranks can't be hurt (could they ever be?)

Only the core of KoC - those mid rank players that make up alliances are most vulnerable, and that's really what a lot of KoC is about isn't it? Wars that break those players up are what break up an alliance. Anyways, I think a lot of you have to take foot out of mouth and head out of asshole and think about it, I agree that some changes should be made (as I pointed out above) but I don't think the whole game is ruined because of it, I think it's a welcome change in the right direction to make the game more fairer for a larger audience (and you'll never be able to make it completely fair or make everyone happy) but it does really seem to me now that the bigger more powerful alliances are stronger...and really is that so bad? Surely we should all be striving to be stronger and make our alliances stronger, and not expect to just be a tiny little group of sabbers and be able to hurt anyone without being touchable at all yourself.

*prepares to be flamed by all those who are narrow-minded and haven't really thought it through* :burned:

Fianor
6th October 2007, 10:14 PM
How do you propose, as sab is, that people stop farmers from turn farming? We have no way to defend ourselves. It's that simple. We have no way of helping clanmates who are being turn farmed. As it stands there is no way to wage a war. That ruins the game. Certainly #1 doesn't see it that way, as what you are concerned with is making sure that no one can hurt your account in any way. Congratz, you got it as of now. Hope you enjoy winning an age with no challenge and no skill involved.

You go ahead and keep clicking along with your officers. Glad you enjoy being little more than a trained monkey clicking 1 of 10 numbers ... OH NO not a misclick ....

GiantDave_WoC
7th October 2007, 03:02 AM
All you need is 100 successful sabs to reduce their entire account value down by 10%.

yes cos people can do 100 successful sabs

first you need to find 40-60 people which not enough people in KoC would ever be able to sab you anyway

then the enemy has to buy no weapons.

and this is with the enemy doing nothing about it

utter rubbish again

GiantDave

Asianguard
7th October 2007, 09:35 AM
u cant really sab anyone except on the 1st page right now...

people who are getting farmed have no way to retaliate and there really is nothing to sab because of the sab rules

in my experience u are lucky to get 10 people to sab at a time with fairly high spy....20 or more is not realistic and so a sab clan will never be able to consistently sab 10% of a persons account everyday for a week....once again u have to assume that they all have the spy to sab this account

Right now in KoC there is no such thing as "wars" and there isnt really any chaos in KoC because u can sab only a select few in the top 50s and there is nothing to sab from the top 1k of KoC

Because the age is ending in 3 months, all the of the theories that sab will become much stronger or sabbers can do damage later are nonexistent

Gallows
15th October 2007, 09:56 AM
I do not do my research as intensively as a lot of you seem to, but from where Im sitting the new sab rules make the game fairer and more playable. At the end of the day sabbers can still do the damage they want regardless of any cap, and especially if they are in a clan with other sabbers. In my experience of previous ages, there is very little anyone can do against a group of sabbers who want to show you what they can do. The best you can do is send messages or take their gold which usually results in more sabbing anyway. I have generally been a midtable player in the past and so I welcome these changes with open arms because they give me more of a chance to play and enjoy the game. The rules dont rule out sabbing, they just make it harder, and as there is no way to retaliate it makes the game fairer.


So I ask for those people who feel they cannot protect their officers from farming to consider that with the old rules, people could not protect their officers from sabbers. Even now they cannot but the damadge done is now more limited.

Go easy people, its my first real post. Its a personal opinion so please take it as such

chaser1
15th October 2007, 11:28 AM
Yes there is a meeting of sabbers. Consult your local IRC sab alliance channels. If you are a known sabber, you may have a chance to put your two cents in.

Kartel
15th October 2007, 12:02 PM
hate the game dont even play much. Giving it a chance though when ppl have enough to sabb let me start sabbing. dont think the admins care about the quality of the game as much as they care about the quantity of ppl playing it. If the limit clicking thing was done to prevent ppl from spending too much time on koc then it definately works. I have not been on irc for about a week. During that week i hardly even bank. Not fun any more just playing for officers to sell in the end and to actually sabb somone for once in this age :S aman gets a F for all the changes he made so far. The game suck.

Lor20_RJ
15th October 2007, 01:09 PM
that meeting was over a week ago which is when the changes were made.... not sure why someone brought this topic back up

Deathdoc
15th October 2007, 01:42 PM
All you need is 100 successful sabs to reduce their entire account value down by 10%.

yes cos people can do 100 successful sabs

first you need to find 40-60 people which not enough people in KoC would ever be able to sab you anyway

then the enemy has to buy no weapons.

and this is with the enemy doing nothing about it

utter rubbish again

GiantDave

You should start reading texts with paying more intention and maybe than replies like that won't happen... NJ talked about middle sized and ranked account that can be reduced to 10% (and that is not even optimistic). A normal war takes several days, and if you are on of these so called "fat" targets, easy to be sabbed and alot inventory, than you were normally sure that you were sabbed by most opponents. Last age you were able to sab like 3x as better sabber successfully at least, so take just a bunch of 10 sabbers like that and sent them 3 days and you would have that result. A war chain is well in wars if they sab alot and successfull. The more and the longer the better.



I do not do my research as intensively as a lot of you seem to, but from where Im sitting the new sab rules make the game fairer and more playable. At the end of the day sabbers can still do the damage they want regardless of any cap, and especially if they are in a clan with other sabbers. In my experience of previous ages, there is very little anyone can do against a group of sabbers who want to show you what they can do. The best you can do is send messages or take their gold which usually results in more sabbing anyway. I have generally been a midtable player in the past and so I welcome these changes with open arms because they give me more of a chance to play and enjoy the game. The rules dont rule out sabbing, they just make it harder, and as there is no way to retaliate it makes the game fairer.


So I ask for those people who feel they cannot protect their officers from farming to consider that with the old rules, people could not protect their officers from sabbers. Even now they cannot but the damadge done is now more limited.

Go easy people, its my first real post. Its a personal opinion so please take it as such

Is war fair? Has war to be fair? Do you have to be able to defeat all other styles of accounts with your ranker setting? I think you know the answers yourself. Sabbers were actually never advanced. If you did adapt as slayer last age, you owned 10x more than a sabber as long you had turns. Not even a whole sab chain was able to really do enough damage against a 640 setting with a nice SA. Sabbers do not have any advantages with sabbing. They loose inventory for sure (did you even consider that others might loose 50+ mill gold in tools a day?), and do not gain any gold with it. And sabbers were not untouchable last age. If you massed alot, you were able to do alot damage and costs. 640 setting needed alot more mercs and soldiers in defense. So don't come here with fair and unfair if you did not even understand the difference tactics how to adapt your account and fight different settings. Now that NO ONE can self defend, where is the sense?

Anyway, in my eyes some of NJ's points are ok (especially that the sab turns have to disapear again), some not (the bigger the alliance, the stronger??, that's crap. If they can fight better, ok, but not because they have maybe more sab turns in total...)
Sabbing tools is crap of course. Not only that rankers would get totally killed (so not only 10%...) but also it is senseless and without need. You loose them anyways if you do not succeed. Maybe instead a kind of damage to weapons and repair thingy there, too.
Admins did reduce amount of gold in game and did nothing to counter. We have less players now, less gold for coverts, but more attack turns to use.

Nevertheless, can anyone tell me who these famous sabbers are? Or just some bss """"nightmares""""?

ExcalibuR
15th October 2007, 01:44 PM
Funny how you can't mass attack anymore with 5x1.

Scaramilk
15th October 2007, 02:33 PM
Maybe because there is no such thing as 5*1 but only 5* now

Kartel
15th October 2007, 03:03 PM
that meeting was over a week ago which is when the changes were made.... not sure why someone brought this topic back up


Because after a week we still dont like the changes. duh!!!!

Asianguard
15th October 2007, 07:09 PM
well when asked about massing this is how rocco replied,
[14:55] <Rocco> an individual attack turn this age is worth much less than 15 attack turns last age
[14:56] <Rocco> so, massing is still a possiblity, it just has a higher "cost"

i still think there are problems with massing and the whole attack turn system, but at least some changes are being made and sabbing is getting a little more powerful

people just need to wait a bit and things will take effect...im sure the admins are aware of the problems that people are bringing up seeing as they read the forums....whether they choose to act on those things is up to them

melf_the_elf
16th October 2007, 10:38 AM
i still think there are problems with massing and the whole attack turn system, but at least some changes are being made and sabbing is getting a little more powerfulI think the admins see "wars" as a problem as they think "people might quit if they get trashed and we will lose money that way"

So they make people quitting over getting owned harder, sabbing gets trashed, UP gets boosted to 2560 while 5x1'ing gets way more expensive AND sabturns are introduced to make sabbing furtherly pointless.

And the result is that now even more people quit over a boring game **sigh**


kind regards, melf the elf

chaser1
16th October 2007, 11:04 AM
I think the admins see "wars" as a problem as they think "people might quit if they get trashed and we will lose money that way"

So they make people quitting over getting owned harder, sabbing gets trashed, UP gets boosted to 2560 while 5x1'ing gets way more expensive AND sabturns are introduced to make sabbing furtherly pointless.

And the result is that now even more people quit over a boring game **sigh**


kind regards, melf the elf

Well, go tell em what changes you would like to see implemented. What do YOU think would improve the game, yet keep it from being the same shit like it was throughout age 6&7. I remember people quitting in those ages because it became a repetitious monotony.

My opinion. I think each race should get a unique ability. That would be kewl.

My thoughts:
Dwarves could buy walls that could double their DA for a short amount of time. Usable only once a day
Orcs could hire a ruthless leader (60% extra SA, opt to do no damage but instead destroy covert tools)
Elves (buy an expensive covert agent who has a chance to infiltrate enemy bases and steal a % of non race specific weapons, armors or tools
Humans Could invest a certain amount of money into economic development managers to decrease the cost of one specific item by 75%% (specific weapons, armor, covert tools, training or mercs)
Undead sacrifice a % of troops to have 24 hours to raise the dead of all fallen enemy soldiers in the battlefield (From attacking and defending)


Notice that I didnt include any specifics on cost as Im not sure where it would be fair to unfair. Its something to think about. The game is the same old stuff and the only thing differentiating the races are items and bonuses.

I started a post about it here: http://www.giveupalready.com/showthread.php?t=60052

aero_zeppelin
21st October 2007, 03:20 PM
Aww... People whined for 2 ages that sabbing was ruining the game. They finally got what they wanted.
So now that sabbing is dead, people still complain?

:yay:


Now the game is dead, chaos is no more. Well done!

Wraith-
21st October 2007, 03:33 PM
Looks as if the admins are damned if they do and damned if they don't.

For guys who once attracted a hundred-thousand accounts, they can't do a lot right, can they?

bake
24th October 2007, 03:17 PM
I have a 6 million spy rating and can't even sab a guy with a sentry of 34k? This age has gone to crap.