The Book of Mormon

[Jebus]

Written in the 1800s, the Book of Mormon is the key point to the Mormon religion. But can it be true?

There are some things in it that could relate to actual history in the Americas, and it fits in with a certain time period in the Bible. But could Joseph Smith simply have written it, using information gained from the Bible?

He claims to have seen God and Jesus Christ, among with a number of angels and heavenly messengers. But is it simply their word against others?

How can you find out the truth of it? Anyone have any thoughts on the subject?

[Phyrus]

all i understand about mormonism is that they cannot eat/wear anything that affects the state of mind and their bible either fully or in some ways contradicts the catholic (i think) bible.

however honestly i dont study religion, so i cant say much without decent or any backup sources at all.

No offense, but this is borderline shitposting or slutposting or whatever it's called. Try to have a little more substance next time.

[DevilWithAHalo]

Written in the 1800s, the Book of Mormon is the key point to the Mormon religion. But can it be true?

True meaning it was written then or whether or not the book is accurate?

To answer both, it was written about that time period and it is as accurate as any other religious doctrite. The key difference, is the Book of Mormon was written to include much more recent history than any other book. Can you name a book that was written (religiously speaking) within 100 years of the events taking place?


There are some things in it that could relate to actual history in the Americas, and it fits in with a certain time period in the Bible. But could Joseph Smith simply have written it, using information gained from the Bible?

Anyone writting religiously takes things from other sources, the Bible just happens to be the most common source of information. I'm a little hazey to the point of your question, care to reitterate?


He claims to have seen God and Jesus Christ, among with a number of angels and heavenly messengers. But is it simply their word against others?

How many prophets and apostles claim the same thing? Pretty much every book in the Bible has angels and God visiting mankind. What makes their word more believable over his? If I said I saw an Angel, would you believe me? This just degenerates into a he said she said scenerio.


How can you find out the truth of it? Anyone have any thoughts on the subject?

How does anyone find the truth in anything? If it works for them, go for it. If they dont believe in it, no big deal. Each to his own.

If your asking for accuracy, I suggest comparing the text to documented history and seeing if they fit. The rest would be spiritual intervention.


all i understand about mormonism is that they cannot eat/wear anything that affects the state of mind and their bible either fully or in some ways contradicts the catholic (i think) bible.

I'm confused by this statement. They suggest not to consume anything that would damage the body, such as coffee or caffine, but its not a 'law' persay. Care to reitterate this?

[RamsFan07]

i'm sorry, i wouldn't ever believe in the mormon book because first of all, only one person found it and wrote it so to speak, and none of the places mentioned in the mormon book have been proven true, unlike the bible, which every place has

[DevilWithAHalo]

i'm sorry, i wouldn't ever believe in the mormon book because first of all, only one person found it and wrote it so to speak, and none of the places mentioned in the mormon book have been proven true, unlike the bible, which every place has

Just out of sheer curiousity, have you ever actually read the book?

Again, if you wish to argue to validity of the Bible, please do so in its own thread.



Also an additional point I need to make quickly here, is that the Mormon Religion actually has four total books.

The Book of Mormon
The Pearl of Great Price
Doctrine and Covenants
The Bible

The reason these additional books were created (according to Mormon doctrine and located within the additional books) was that there were additional books ommited from the Bible (due to numerous reasons) and to clear up the aperent inconsistancies contained within the Bible.

I would suggest anyone interested to actually read these books as they are quite interesting. For those of you that worry about 'certain things', I read them all and I'm still Agnostic, so dont assume you'll fall under a spell or anything. :)

[HookerBodyShots]

i'm sorry, i wouldn't ever believe in the mormon book because first of all, only one person found it and wrote it so to speak, and none of the places mentioned in the mormon book have been proven true, unlike the bible, which every place has

What do you mean "proven true"? Is it not possible that any acts might be just people taking natural phenomenons for acts of God? I could write a Bible that mentions several crazy happenings in the past 500 years and it is "proven true" as well.

Additionally, the Bible's sections were all written by one person at a time... Unless you believe that each section was plotted out by a group of people.

[Phyrus]

I'm confused by this statement. They suggest not to consume anything that would damage the body, such as coffee or caffine, but its not a 'law' persay. Care to reitterate this?

thats what i meant :tongue: as i said i dont study religion so i dont really know much, only from what i hear.

[Christ's Bro]

i'm sorry, i wouldn't ever believe in the mormon book because first of all, only one person found it and wrote it so to speak, and none of the places mentioned in the mormon book have been proven true, unlike the bible, which every place has

Sorry RamsFan, but you are overstating the facts a bit there, unless I'm farther behind in my studies of Biblical archaeology than I thought I was.

PS: Just a question, but is anyone where a Mormon, or have a Mormon Bible handy? I don't have one yet, but from what I've heard it's a bitt wacky (at least the original was, tons of revisions and rewritings that make no sense from what I've heard, but I don't know if there's anything behind that). My information's probably pretty biased against the Mormons, just wondering if anyone's got a reference.

[DevilWithAHalo]

Sorry RamsFan, but you are overstating the facts a bit there, unless I'm farther behind in my studies of Biblical archaeology than I thought I was.

Kudos to you for pointing that out.


PS: Just a question, but is anyone where a Mormon, or have a Mormon Bible handy? I don't have one yet, but from what I've heard it's a bitt wacky (at least the original was, tons of revisions and rewritings that make no sense from what I've heard, but I don't know if there's anything behind that). My information's probably pretty biased against the Mormons, just wondering if anyone's got a reference.

I come from a Mormon family so I could ask them questions on your behalf if I dont already know. (Again to point out, I'm Agnostic) And I think I have a Book of Mormon at home, so it would take me a little while to look up passages you wanted to know more about.

The main thing I should point out to you, that almost everywhere you research, there is a heavy set anti-Mormon bias apparent. Just keep that in mind when you find your answers.

Also to point out, the Bible and other religious texts are just as wacky at times, and sure you can think of some pretty strange stories in it, like the Fig tree and the burning bush, etc.



Quick Moderators note here, as established in the rules, topics such as these, especially in my experience when dealing with the Mormon faith, can incite bashing, I dont want to see any bashing! Questions about it and opinions can be expressed relatively freely while keeping in mind that every single religion has basis in its own right and poeple who have faith in it that could get offended. So just be careful. Thank you.

[RamsFan07]

yes i have read the book of mormon, my friend is one and i asked him to give it to me

[Pengamos]

Then you should know from the first book of Nephi that they(Nephi's family) left Jerusalem because his father had a vision from God that Jerusalem would be destroyed. Jerusalem=existed.

Granted, Joseph's retrival of the golden plates from the hill Cumorah and the subsequent translation is a little shaky but so are a lot of other religious texts' origins.

edit: err added translation too.

[Jebus]

True meaning it was written then or whether or not the book is accurate?

Whether or not the book is accurate, even just historically.


The key difference, is the Book of Mormon was written to include much more recent history than any other book. Can you name a book that was written (religiously speaking) within 100 years of the events taking place?

Correct me if I’m wrong, but the Book of Mormon ended with the last event taking place some two thousand years ago.


Anyone writting religiously takes things from other sources, the Bible just happens to be the most common source of information. I'm a little hazey to the point of your question, care to reitterate?

I believe that Lehi and Nephi left Jerusalem around the time of Zedekiah. But did Joseph Smith simply take information on names and such from the bible to add them to the Book of Mormon?


The reason these additional books were created (according to Mormon doctrine and located within the additional books) was that there were additional books ommited from the Bible (due to numerous reasons) and to clear up the aperent inconsistancies contained within the Bible.

To my knowledge, they were also created to add new instruction to the Mormon believers, and documents a lot of the early history.


PS: Just a question, but is anyone where a Mormon, or have a Mormon Bible handy? I don't have one yet, but from what I've heard it's a bitt wacky (at least the original was, tons of revisions and rewritings that make no sense from what I've heard, but I don't know if there's anything behind that). My information's probably pretty biased against the Mormons, just wondering if anyone's got a reference.

The Mormons use the King James Version of the bible, with some additions. They have footnotes, cross referencing it with other books in the bible and their literature, as well as some “divine translations”. The actual text is the exact same text as that used by several other religions.


Then you should know from the first book of Nephi that they(Nephi's family) left Jerusalem because his father had a vision from God that Jerusalem would be destroyed. Jerusalem=existed.

Ah, but wasn’t Jerusalem overrun by Babylon, or some other such nation, not too long after Nephi and Lehi left? Again, correct me if I’m wrong on this.

[DevilWithAHalo]

Whether or not the book is accurate, even just historically.

I will say this much, it is as accurate as any other religious text that I have read. Basically taking documented history and given a 'divine reasoning' spin on things.


Correct me if I’m wrong, but the Book of Mormon ended with the last event taking place some two thousand years ago.

Hmm, I dont remember, I will have to double check that. Although like a few books, I may be thinking of something out of order or it was printed that way.


I believe that Lehi and Nephi left Jerusalem around the time of Zedekiah. But did Joseph Smith simply take information on names and such from the bible to add them to the Book of Mormon?

Well, it talks about poeple like Jesus, so you could say he did. But then did the Bible just make up names? Or take name from real poeple and put them into the Bible as a completely different character?


To my knowledge, they were also created to add new instruction to the Mormon believers, and documents a lot of the early history.

Right, just as any new religion, it needs rules and different documents than other religions if they dont want to be the same thing.

Although if you think about it, there are several denominations of Christianity that all use the Bible and nothing else, the only difference is interpretations of certain portions of it.


The Mormons use the King James Version of the bible, with some additions. They have footnotes, cross referencing it with other books in the bible and their literature, as well as some “divine translations”. The actual text is the exact same text as that used by several other religions.

Right, they were even quoted to saying, "...as long as it is translated correctly." Which is where the new books come in to straiten that out apparently.

I suppose you could assume that they intentionally left the Bible alone for a few reasons; additional persecution or familiarity with recruition of other religions, etc.


Ah, but wasn’t Jerusalem overrun by Babylon, or some other such nation, not too long after Nephi and Lehi left? Again, correct me if I’m wrong on this.

Your guess is as good as mine, I would need to brush up on my history.

[RamsFan07]

when i say cities not found, i mean cities not found in the bible, and plus another reason i don't like mormonism is when they die, they believe in different levels of heaven, and they can be like a god and create a world, and thats blasphemy

[DevilWithAHalo]

another reason i don't like mormonism is when they die, they believe in different levels of heaven, and they can be like a god and create a world, and thats blasphemy

Can you cite scripture or documentation to support this blasphemy?

I was under the assumption, even if you had the power to create a world, God was still your God, so its a moot point.

[SataiDelenn]

I tried reading the Mormon Bible once. I used to be friends with someone who is a Mormon and we went to high school together. When he turned 18, he packed up and moved out to Utah to join other Mormons there. I lost touch with him, but my friends continued to get letters from him every once in a while and they said that his letters progressively got stranger and stranger in content to them. He basically freaked them out after a while so they stopped writing. At one of the colleges I attended I came across a Mormon Bible and tried reading it, but it just seemed too strange to me in some of the things that it said. Unfortunately I can't remember what I read but I do remember that I thought it was pretty strange in viewpoint and difficult to follow. Please understand, I have nothing against anyone who's religious. I respect all people's rights to believe in what they want. I'm just saying from what I read in this particular area, the ideas and concepts in the Mormon Bible were a bit strange for me.

[Pengamos]

I believe that Lehi and Nephi left Jerusalem around the time of Zedekiah. But did Joseph Smith simply take information on names and such from the bible to add them to the Book of Mormon?

Ah, but wasn’t Jerusalem overrun by Babylon, or some other such nation, not too long after Nephi and Lehi left? Again, correct me if I’m wrong on this.

Sure it's possible but couldn't the writers of the Bible used other ancient documents to validate their claims.

Yes it was Babylon, that was the destruction they were fleeing from but to their knowledge they didn't know how the destruction was going to come, they just had faith that it was because of the vision that Lehi had.


and plus another reason i don't like mormonism is when they die, they believe in different levels of heaven, and they can be like a god and create a world, and thats blasphemy

Like DWaH said please site a reference where that is stated. I think you just have a misconception of the belief. I do agree that it's somewhat silly because it goes back to the basics of the Rear Admirals "I'm going to Heaven" thread.

From my understanding, as you mention, there are different levels of the after life, I wouldn't say Heaven because technically only the Celestial kingdom is Heaven. The Terrestrial kingdom is a middle ground for all souls that lead good lives but weren't Mormon. While the Telestial is supposed to be Hell. A basic belief structure granting Mormons a greater reward for being Mormons which is why I related it back to the "I'm going to Heaven" thread. Never have I heard that they can be like a god and create a world. Site it and I might believe your claim.

[Jebus]

when i say cities not found, i mean cities not found in the bible, and plus another reason i don't like mormonism is when they die, they believe in different levels of heaven, and they can be like a god and create a world, and thats blasphemy

Allow me to attempt to clear some things up. Mormons believe that at the judgment, they will go to one of four different places. The Celestial Kingdom is the highest level, for those that did all they could to uphold and obey the Mormon religion. The next level down is for those that did a pretty good job of it, or were otherwise good people. Third level down is for those that weren’t good people, or who rejected the church. And the fourth level is called Outer Darkness; the absolutely evil people go there.

Also, they believe that they gain the powers of God, and become Gods; yet are simply Gods underneath the God. Sort of like territorial managers underneath the President.


Sure it's possible but couldn't the writers of the Bible used other ancient documents to validate their claims.

Sure, but how does a boy in his teens, with little formal education, get his hands on histories such as that? And could they be comprehensive enough at the time (Remember, it’s the early 1800’s) to give a realistic and truthful historical account of the Americas in BC times?

[DevilWithAHalo]

Allow me to attempt to clear some things up. Mormons believe that at the judgment, they will go to one of four different places. The Celestial Kingdom is the highest level, for those that did all they could to uphold and obey the Mormon religion. The next level down is for those that did a pretty good job of it, or were otherwise good people. Third level down is for those that weren’t good people, or who rejected the church. And the fourth level is called Outer Darkness; the absolutely evil people go there.

Also, they believe that they gain the powers of God, and become Gods; yet are simply Gods underneath the God. Sort of like territorial managers underneath the President.

Thats pretty accurate. Although if you do reject their beleifs at that point (assuming its true mind you) you would be sent down to outer darkness. Bad poeple arn't admitted into heaven, but they have the oppurtunity to repent their wicked ways and become good poeple.

If I can find it and figure out how to post it, I saw a really good graph that detailed their beliefs in regards to the stages of spiritual development and the after life.


Sure, but how does a boy in his teens, with little formal education, get his hands on histories such as that? And could they be comprehensive enough at the time (Remember, it’s the early 1800’s) to give a realistic and truthful historical account of the Americas in BC times?

How do hillbillies with no education whatsoever become rich overnight? Why did there just happen to be oil under their property and not mine? How does someone come across a gold vein in California? Why did Jesus deicde to show up at that exact point in time and not now?

It's all chance.

Remember, you or I could write a journal of our own and in 100 years call it historicaly accurate to what happened in our time. Keeping in mind though, our journal and their religious text, only encompased a portion of what happened during that time period.

[Jebus]

Let me see if I remember the steps.

1: Premortal life

You're with all the other Humans that haven't been born yet.

2: Life

Obvious one.

3: Spirit Prison/Spirit Paradise

This is the one that I think is idiosyncratic to the Mormon religion. All those who are good Mormons go to Paradise, while those that were bad, or didn't accept the Mormon gospel on Earth go to the prison. Those in paradise teach those in prison, and the Mormons do baptism's for the dead, allowing the dead to accept the gospel and be repent of their sins.

4: Judgement

You look at your life, and are judged according to your will. It's not just what you did, but also what you wanted to do.

5: Spiritual endgame

You get sent to whatever degree of Heaven you earned.

I think that about sums it up.