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White_Hindu
31st January 2005, 11:22 AM
Lately I've been hearing about the Firefox users' boom in population, and I started wondering what some advantages and disadvantages are associated with using Mozilla Firefox. I've heard mixed reviews.

My internet browsing habits are pretty decent, I've not had a piece of spyware nor a virus for years. Is there a reason why I should replace MSIE with Firefox?

Flocito
31st January 2005, 11:45 AM
Well, my main reasons to use Firefox would be:

1) Build in pop-up blocker
2) Tabbed browsing
3) Doesn't automatically install spyware like IE
4) Ability to right click on images and select "Block all images from server"
5) Lightweight and faster

Fascist Jock Itch
31st January 2005, 11:52 AM
Firefox is a great great browser. It has its flaws (doesn't handle some javascript very well, some GIFs depreciate when viewed in it, and sometimes it doesn't properly install the plugins it downloads) but I haven't actually had a proper chance to test the 1.0 release so take everything I say just a tad bit lightly.

I like IE. With SP2 installed on XP it has a pretty decent pop-up blocker. The lackage of tabbed browsing is a pain in the ass, and of course the spyware problems. Give me simplicity and a daily ad-aware scan anyday though.

Like I said though, it is a great browser. And anyone who can't see that is a moron.

Perad
31st January 2005, 12:43 PM
Firefox haqs all of the plus's above and only really suffers from a few incompatible pages. I say a few. In all my time browsing i have probably hit 5.

Firefox also appears to run a bit faster, it gets the job done and it comes with a multibrowser toolbar. As for spyware etc, it seems impervious to the cuntish My search toolbar which plagues my system everytime i open up explorer.

There are people who use firefox then there are people who are scared of change. Why else wouldn't you switch for something which is so much better than explorer

PS i swear there have been a load of topics like this already in this forum

lunchmoney
31st January 2005, 03:02 PM
i happen to not like mozilla products mainly because they have been causing bugs in my system. however a very similar browser to firfox is opera, which is not buggy and has all of the same perks that firefox has. so ive been using opera for awhile now and have had but one problem with it, and that is the active x plugin, it doesnt always work, with certain sites (like gmail).

Phyrus
31st January 2005, 03:33 PM
its not integrated with windows like IE is therefore its not open to security holes too

Stephen
31st January 2005, 03:44 PM
Something that most people won't realise about Firefox is that on GuA when I use [color=stephenkenny], it shows up black. On IE it's blue, but Firefox won't recognize it. Just an interesting tidbit

The pop-up blocker isn't great - I had an awesome one for IE (with a shortcut key to temporarily disable it... very useful).

The tabbed browsing is hella awesome when the need arises. Merging threads is the only use I have for it so far, but it's fun.

The main reason I got it was the spyware. IE was going to shit, and Firefox looked similar enough that I hardly even noticed the difference. You can even import your IE bookmark list.

It's the little things that really do it. Like managing site passwords or setting up exceptions to the cookie blocker. It is all so well put together.

Phyrus
31st January 2005, 04:53 PM
The pop-up blocker isn't great - I had an awesome one for IE (with a shortcut key to temporarily disable it... very useful).

the only ever popup blockers ive used on IE are the actual "Popup Stopper" program which wasnt perfect either, and i also used zone alarm which was perfect popup-blocking wise, but was screwing up my access on mine and my brother's LAN.

FF adblock isnt perfect, but it does the job, doesnt require updating either (not sure on this though)

White_Hindu
31st January 2005, 06:16 PM
Here are my thoughts on Firefox compared with MSIE:

I use MSIE, I don't have spyware. Chances are I won't get spyware, and on the off chance I do get spyware, it's probably because I put it there inadvertently. I don't really have a problem with popups considering the sites I frequently visit don't have any popups. I read that you shouldn't uninstall MSIE because it would reduce functionality of windows. All I see it as is a waste of space.

Oh yeah, tabbed browsing? Check this out! It's really cool!

Flocito
31st January 2005, 06:27 PM
Here are my thoughts on Firefox compared with MSIE:

I use MSIE, I don't have spyware. Chances are I won't get spyware, and on the off chance I do get spyware, it's probably because I put it there inadvertently. Not necessarily. There are now a lot of websites that are using "features" of IE to install adware and spyware to your computer when you visit the site. I'm not talking about just dodgy warez sites either.



I don't really have a problem with popups considering the sites I frequently visit don't have any popups.
That's cool, but with the pop-up blocker, image blocker, and flash blocker, I don't see any of the worthless crap on any site. No need to filter which sites I go to, because even ones that do run pop-ups wont bother me.


I read that you shouldn't uninstall MSIE because it would reduce functionality of windows. All I see it as is a waste of space.
IE and explorer are tied together now, so you can't really remove all the components of IE from your system. Of course, that doesn't mean that you need or should use it as your browser.



Oh yeah, tabbed browsing? Check this out! It's really cool! Yeah, because I want my taskbar full of stupid ass IE boxes, with each one of them using ~15MB of RAM. Whatever works for you though, but I'd much rather run one program that can handle multiple tabs without having to run a separate instance of that program each time. Plus on top of that, when I start up firefox my homepage is about 6 tabs containing the sites I visit all the time. Middle clicking on a link opens it into a new tab so that I can continue reading and go to the link at another time. I guess it's just something you can't explain to someone that hasn't tried tabbed browsing.

Jack
31st January 2005, 11:10 PM
I used to be a big fan of IE on my old laptop running Mac OS 9.1. It worked well, ran smoothly, and handled every task I threw its way.

Then I "upgraded" to a used PowerMac G4 running OS 10.3 which allowed me to use Firefox. And I have to say. It's better than IE by a long shot. The built in popup blocker is awesome. It doesn't "stall out" as IE sometimes does. It seems to load webpages faster. It makes you feel good waving your private parts at Microsoft. I like tabbed browsing, even though I have come to absolutely depend on Exposť. I can't fathom how Windows users can function without it.

I also think that it's marginally better than Safari because the google search bar can search hundreds of sites that you can pick from a pull down list. My only complaint with it is that it doesn't allow you to organize them -- like alphabetically, thematically, or whatever.

My one real complaint with Firefox is that you can't go back by hitting the delete/backspace key. Since you can do that in IE, I keep hitting delete to go back and then cursing.

kazalio
1st February 2005, 02:00 PM
You shouldn't use MSIE, many websites advise you not to because many websites are saying that it can't catch many of the bad things that download on the web behind your back. Microsoft was never good at anti virus or anti spyware.

Firefox may have been made with the help of a 15 year old, but still it's quick, blocks popups if you have a slow connection it will block web adverts. You can also set it to remember your passwords, but you're probably better off using an encrypted file is you have lot's of passwords.

_outlaw
1st February 2005, 04:56 PM
My one real complaint with Firefox is that you can't go back by hitting the delete/backspace key. Since you can do that in IE, I keep hitting delete to go back and then cursing.

...yes you can... i just did it in fact...

Flocito
1st February 2005, 06:08 PM
My one real complaint with Firefox is that you can't go back by hitting the delete/backspace key. Since you can do that in IE, I keep hitting delete to go back and then cursing. ...yes you can... i just did it in fact... Well, it all depends what key Jack is talking about _outlaw since he listed both the delete and backspace key. The backspace key will take you back in Firefox, but the delete button does not.

Of course I tested it in IE and the delete button doesn't take you back either, so he must have meant the backspace key. But since the backspace key works in both browsers I'm not sure what Jack is talking about.

Jack
1st February 2005, 06:28 PM
Flocito... On Apple keyboards, the key in the upper right corner but below the F keys is a delete key. I just wish they would have taken that into account when writing the version for Macintosh. Microsoft did when they wrote IE for Macintosh.

kazalio
2nd February 2005, 02:06 PM
All in all MSIE is better than Fire Fox. Fire Fox maybe nable to keep your passwords, block popups and stuff but MSIE does the best at the most vital thing, displaying content. Anyone with the basic knowlege of Javascript or CSS know that bits of code will not work in non IE browsers. Also the page can look differently. Position Absolute may look O.K in IE but in Firefox it may look really rubbish with text going overlapped everywhere.

Even though everybody hates Microsoft, I have to say that it is the best browzer of them all, but Fire Fox is one of the better ones. Better that Opera in my Opinion (Opera takes up too much of the screen.)

MCeley
3rd February 2005, 07:02 AM
Firefox is much better for many of the same reasons that everybody has already said. The tabbed browsing feature is very awesome cuz when using windows xp if you open too many windows of the same program then it collapses them all into one and you can't select each one as easy but the tabs keep them all seperate. The popup blocker is very awesome because my brother's and mom's computers both use IE and they have soooo many viruses and spyware and popups that I refuse to even get near their computers. I like that fact that the downloads window has all the downloads as one instead of a million different windows for your downloads to get confused if you download a lot at one time. Plus the options menu is much more compact and less confusing than Netscape or IE. The search feature is much faster cuz they use google to search instead of the ever retard msn search. The best thing though is the fact that you can customize and skin your own Firefox as opposed to IE. That and you can help with the coding of the Firefox project from your house. I have only made very minor contributions that aren't on the visual side but I still like that I get to help. Overall I say Firefox is the way to go.

Guardian77
3rd February 2005, 01:15 PM
Anyone with the basic knowlege of Javascript or CSS know that bits of code will not work in non IE browsers.

No offense, but WHERE DID YOU HEAR THIS?

If code doesn't work in Firefox, but does in IE, it's because the person making the page ISN'T following W3C standards.

Stephen
3rd February 2005, 02:06 PM
Flocito... On Apple keyboards, the key in the upper right corner but below the F keys is a delete key. I just wish they would have taken that into account when writing the version for Macintosh. Microsoft did when they wrote IE for Macintosh.
I think I found your problem: "Macintosh".

Is there something wrong with Safari? I thought that it was the mother of Mac browsers. What's so great about IE that you would even think about using it?

It just seems like an odd browser choice to me.

Crayon Violent
4th February 2005, 08:56 AM
No offense, but WHERE DID YOU HEAR THIS?

If code doesn't work in Firefox, but does in IE, it's because the person making the page ISN'T following W3C standards.

Well, yes and no. IE is a lot more lenient on the standards, therefore there are a lot of extra "features" that IE has. For instance, being able to color your scrollers.

But, as a novice-intermediate web-developer, I would say that I have run into more compatability issues with firefox than IE. Sometimes flash objects will not display in my firefox browser, whereas they will display okay in IE. I can open the Firefox browser, and sometimes it will display, and sometimes it won't.

Also, with tables. Sometimes they will display proper, sometimes they will not, in firefox. and I KNOW the code is right.

firefox seems to have trouble with PHP too, not just javascript. For example: the table example I listed above. part of the table tags are inside my php script, while other parts of them are not. If i made the same table completely in html, firefox does not run into problems. if i mix it up, then it does - about 50% of the time. in IE, i have never had a problem with the tables displaying properly, regardless of how I have them.

firefox has a lot of nifty features and plugins. The "show passwords" feature has come in handy for me on several occasions. The tabbed windows are neat; however, for several things I do, it is more convenient for me to open a whole new browser anyway. I have a lot of web-developer plugins for firefox, that has made things easier for me, as far as learning how to do things, and other such stuff.

Firefox is not very good at handling scripts, as others have mentioned. I can't tell you how many times I have...tell you what, I will give an example. The other day, I went to HRBlock to file my taxes online. I went there in firefox. I was having a very difficult time doing it, because firefox was not processing a lot of the javascript right. for instance, normally, when HRBlock had a field for you to enter, there was a ? mark next to it that you could click and find out more info about it. It would not work in firefox. I eventually had to start all over in IE - where the ? marks would work; a little window was supposed to popup explaining what i was supposed to be entering.

far as PHP, it is compiled on the server, which has nothing to do with firefox; however, like i said, everytime i try and mix and match things, like having a table tag as regular html, the td and tr as html, but then have php auto generate the / tags (you know, for displaying database info nice and neatly in tables), i run into problems. and i know it's not cuz i'm doing it wrong (i have consulted 4 different books, countless tutorial sites, and even had 2 professional web-designers look at it); sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't.

IE: well, yes, i would say it is a lot less secure. I don't think anybody is arguing that point. But it is more stable and compatible than firefox, when it comes to being a web-developer. Part of that compatibility comes from not strictly adhering to the standards, but then you have to ask yourself, maybe the standards should be changed.

I attribute firefox's shortcomings to it not being around as long as IE. I say give it time, and it WILL be better.

IE - well, I don't know why microsoft refuses to address it's issues properly. I think that if they did, then IE would be a definate rival.

Mark
4th February 2005, 02:09 PM
Anyone with the basic knowlege of Javascript or CSS know that bits of code will not work in non IE browsers. Also the page can look differently. Position Absolute may look O.K in IE but in Firefox it may look really rubbish with text going overlapped everywhere.

You must be joking. Firefox is far more compatible with the standards than IE is, especially for CSS. You may not like how it looks in Firefox, but that's how it's supposed to look according to the specifications; IE is displaying it wrong and there are many things in CSS that can not be done in IE at all.
Check out css / edge (http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/edge/index.html) and see how it looks in IE. Then check out the gallery to see how it should look, how Firefox displays it.

TheOne
5th February 2005, 03:09 AM
All in all MSIE is better than Fire Fox. Fire Fox maybe nable to keep your passwords, block popups and stuff


In general SP2 fixes all/most of the stuff, Eg. Managing Add-In's, blocking sites ability to try to install thing's, pop-up blocker,etc. etc.

If you don't like the pop-up blocker then there are plenty of alternatives.

I'm not sure why some people think FireFox is special because it can keep passwords, IE has been able to do that for years, I think I remember seeing it on IE3.

The only real difference GUI wise is the tabbed browsing; While I have FireFox and generally use tabbed browsing, I'm more comfortable with having windows open.

White_Hindu, You disabled Task Bar grouping...

Code-Wise some people like to argue that it has "kool" CSS features that IE doesn't because IE is "sux0rs".
Generally IE tries to display things properly even if there is an error.

Seeing as how IE was around even before the W3C standards were put it place, it would make sense that it should have generic compatability with code.
Code has always been displayed differently Browser-Wise, Remember the IE-Netscape wars?

FF's image placeholder... Nasty.

For the open-source people that argue that as a point, You should be using FireBird, not FireFox.